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Our HARP refi through Quicken is asking us for an extra $1000 to closing for subordinating fees this is high right?

by kraigc3532 from , . Jul 2nd 2013 Reply


Joe Metzler (JoeMetzler)
#1 ranked lender in Minnesota - 3,560 contributions

Would have saved a lot of confusion is there was a professional loan officer involved....

Jul 2nd 2013
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William J Acres (William_Acres)
#1 ranked lender in Arizona - 8,008 contributions

It depends on who is actually charging the Fee.. typically, if you have a 2nd that needs to be re subordinated, then that lender has a fee for doing such... typically, it's around $200-$350, so yes.. $1000 is high, but it's not a "Quicken" fee, it's your existing 2nd mortgage who charges the fee.. Now, if your talking about Quicken charging you $1000 more because you have a 2nd mortgage, then that would be a fee charged by them, and it is high.. because of some the way Quicken prices their loans, we hardly use them for HARP refi's even though we're signed up with them.. depending on how far along you are with them, you might want to consider changing lenders.. that would blow out any rate lock you have currently (assuming your rate is locked), so without knowing how far along you are, it's hard to advise you properly.. .. I'm a Broker here in Scottsdale AZ and I only lend in Arizona. If you or someone you know is looking for financing options, feel free to contact me or pass along my information. 480-287-5714 WilliamAcres.com

Jul 2nd 2013
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David Sanders (David_Sanders)
#781 ranked lender in California - 59 contributions

First off for Quicken. 4.75% is not a good HARP rate right now. You are locked until mid August? Good grief. Why? 45 days is enough for a HARP deal with a subordination. The longer you lock the higher your rate will be. (Calculated by yield spread) Someone did their math wrong when they were reviewing the HUD. Quicken will have 6 different people working on your loan. With a 760 FICO do you want your information in the hands of 6 different people that are slamming it through with no personal connection? Do yourself a favor and next time get a professional to handle your loan. It is the biggest liability you will own but can become your best investment. Don't play around with it going with your big box lenders. Cannot answer your question completely without more information. It just sounds like a typical mistake by a big box L.O. Fees can be wrapped into the HARP loan but only up to certain amount. So they may have hit the limit and have to have you come in with more cash to close. Bottom line is whoever is handling the loan doesn't have their grasp on it. (From what it sounds)

Jul 2nd 2013
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William J Acres (William_Acres)
#1 ranked lender in Arizona - 8,008 contributions

It depends on who is actually charging the Fee.. typically, if you have a 2nd that needs to be re subordinated, then that lender has a fee for doing such... typically, it's around $200-$350, so yes.. $1000 is high, but it's not a "Quicken" fee, it's your existing 2nd mortgage who charges the fee.. Now, if your talking about Quicken charging you $1000 more because you have a 2nd mortgage, then that would be a fee charged by them, and it is high.. because of some the way Quicken prices their loans, we hardly use them for HARP refi's even though we're signed up with them.. depending on how far along you are with them, you might want to consider changing lenders.. that would blow out any rate lock you have currently (assuming your rate is locked), so without knowing how far along you are, it's hard to advise you properly.. .. I'm a Broker here in Scottsdale AZ and I only lend in Arizona. If you or someone you know is looking for financing options, feel free to contact me or pass along my information. 480-287-5714 WilliamAcres.com

Jul 2nd 2013
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I'm in CO and we have about 10K in negative equity. We have a 80/20 loan 80 with Green Tree and the 20 is with Citi. Everything has been super easy so far and we're locked into a 4.75% rate via the HARP program. I'm assuming the $1000 is a subordination fee because they were in the phase of confirming with our Citi and then suddenly Greentree is asking for us to bring an extra $1000 to the closing. I'm assuming Citi is asking for a fee to stay in the second position with the 20% loan and Greentree is passing the buck to us and then some. We have a call this afternoon. BTW, our credit score is 770 with zero debt outside of our mortgage our $206K total home loan. I'm trying to get as much info as I can before we get on the phone.

Jul 2nd 2013
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Brad Cahoone (info@globalhomefinance.com)
#92 ranked lender in Texas - 1,041 contributions

This question may need some clarification. If you are doing a new second mortgage and buying down the rate that may be ok. If you are subordinating an existing second a lot of some companies will not charge a subordination fee and most that do will charge $200 to $400 at the very highest. If your new loan is thru Quicken and your old first loan is thru Green Tree and your old second is thru Citi then Green Tree cannot charge you new fees for having a second mortgage. Greentree may be charging you fax/ payoff fees but those are usually around $30 and then interest on top of your principal balance which depending on your per a diem interest could be $1000. The best thing for you to do is ask for a copy of the subordination requirements from Citi and copies of payoffs for your loan then an itemization of the fees that Quicken is charging you. They may have some points they added in there without telling you from the time they quoted you to the time they locked in your loan. I hope this helps. I am in Texas and do not service Colorado currently. Brad Cahoone - NMLS ID 184176 - Global Home Finance Inc. - NMLS ID 316441 - bcahoone@globalhomefinance.com

Jul 2nd 2013
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We are doing a refi via Quicken on the first loan which is held by Greentree. Greentree doesn't actually write loans so they use Quicken to do all their HARP refis. We are leaving the second loan with Citi as is. Our rep at Quicken stated it was Greentree that was asking for the extra $1000 at closing. Unfortunately my wife didn't ask why which is why we have a call scheduled for this afternoon. I figured it was a subordination fee Citi was billing Greentree to stay in the second position. I'm going to ask for them to lower the cost to $350 and hope it's not a deal breaker. The $1000 isn't a big deal in the big picture considering I'm lowering my monthly payment by $300 a month, but I feel like someone is just taking advantage of the situation.

Jul 2nd 2013
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We are doing a refi via Quicken on the first loan which is held by Greentree. Greentree doesn't actually write loans so they use Quicken to do all their HARP refis. We are leaving the second loan with Citi as is. Our rep at Quicken stated it was Greentree that was asking for the extra $1000 at closing. Unfortunately my wife didn't ask why which is why we have a call scheduled for this afternoon. I figured it was a subordination fee Citi was billing Greentree to stay in the second position. I'm going to ask for them to lower the cost to $350 and hope it's not a deal breaker. The $1000 isn't a big deal in the big picture considering I'm lowering my monthly payment by $300 a month, but I feel like someone is just taking advantage of the situation.

Jul 2nd 2013
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Joe Metzler (JoeMetzler)
#1 ranked lender in Minnesota - 3,560 contributions

Lenders are not allowed to upsell or upcharge third party fees. If the 2ndf mortgage company is asking for a $1000 subordination fee, simply contact the second mortgage company to verify their fee. That would be the most expensive subordination fee I have ever seen. Usually it is less than $300. As for Quicken, I am not a giant fan of anyone working with a bunch of unlicensed young kids in a call center to handle my largest financial transaction. Are you?

Jul 2nd 2013
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James Mazzola (Mazzola)
#110 ranked lender in New Jersey - 313 contributions

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Jul 2nd 2013
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Elden Lewis (elewis_409_299)
#41 ranked lender in Indiana - 223 contributions

It is starting to sound like Greentree is charging you a Per-payment penalty for early payoff. I think you better be on the phone with Greentree to get to the heart of the matter.

Jul 2nd 2013
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Michelle Curtis Loan Originator NMLS 401173 (EmbassyFundingLLC)
#28 ranked lender in New York - 2,236 contributions

It depends on several things, but two major are, who is subordinating? Is it Fannie or Freddie HarpCall us or email us at 201-962-3555 or Team@BestMortgageOption.com for ano cost no obligation analysis of your situation ask for Michelle or Benny. We will find the Best Mortgage Option to suit your needs! Check us out at www.BestMortgageOption.comAsk us about the awesome discounts we offer heroes as a Homes for Heroes affiliate!

Jul 2nd 2013
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Carlo Sanchez (MortgageLendingPro)
#0 ranked lender in Utah - 1,163 contributions

That seems high so call Greentree and ask them what they are charging. If it isn't that amount then I'd change lenders if I were you to a Lender411 Loan Officer. If it's here in Utah I'd be glad to help you.

Jul 2nd 2013
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So it turned out that Greentree gave Quicken the wrong payoff amount. Because of that the new payout exceeded the amount of the approved loan amount that the subordinated agreed to. Since they couldn't roll the difference into the loan we needed to bring the $1000 to the closing to cover the difference. I'm having them request a new payoff to be sure, which will delay our closing until next week, but better safe than sorry. Our rate is locked until mid August so its not a big deal. Thanks for all the feedback.

Jul 2nd 2013
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Michelle Curtis Loan Originator NMLS 401173 (EmbassyFundingLLC)
#28 ranked lender in New York - 2,236 contributions

Your welcome and good luck!

Jul 2nd 2013
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So it turned out that Greentree gave Quicken the wrong payoff amount. Because of that the new payout exceeded the amount of the approved loan amount that the subordinated agreed to. Since they couldn't roll the difference into the loan we needed to bring the $1000 to the closing to cover the difference. I'm having them request a new payoff to be sure, which will delay our closing until next week, but better safe than sorry. Our rate is locked until mid August so its not a big deal. Thanks for all the feedback.

Jul 2nd 2013
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So it turned out that Greentree gave Quicken the wrong payoff amount. Because of that the new payout exceeded the amount of the approved loan amount that the subordinated agreed to. Since they couldn't roll the difference into the loan we needed to bring the $1000 to the closing to cover the difference. I'm having them request a new payoff to be sure, which will delay our closing until next week, but better safe than sorry. Our rate is locked until mid August so its not a big deal. Thanks for all the feedback.

Jul 2nd 2013
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Pete Bass (PeteBass)
#31 ranked lender in Connecticut - 476 contributions

1000.00 for subordinating fees seems high- if you need to pay the 1000.00 to lower your overall combined loan to value ( CLTV) to get a DU approval, that is another story- if that is the case, make sure that the payoff is 1000.00 less as you are bringing those funds to closing-

Jul 2nd 2013
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Dave Metsker (DaveMetsker)
#37 ranked lender in Oregon - 2,317 contributions

See David's comments. He is right on.

Jul 2nd 2013
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Raymond Denton (Raymond)
#12 ranked lender in Ohio - 224 contributions

Did you find this out at the end of the loan process?

Jul 3rd 2013
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Corey Vandenberg (Coreyv)
#66 ranked lender in Indiana - 15 contributions

If you're ready to refinance again, we can always look at a 15 year rate and see if we can't shave some years off that loan and help you build equity faster! www.phmc.com/coreyvandenberg I would be glad to help you...

Aug 24th 2017
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